How much of China's gold is real?

Prospecting Australia

Help Support Prospecting Australia:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Messages
4,755
Reaction score
5,941
China is supposedly by far the world's largest gold producer, and reports as having the largest gold mine reserves. However is it so (to misquote Julius Sumner Miller)?

This guy is no nutter or financial speculator. He is a gold geologist and was the chief gold expert at the United States Geological Survey for decades, and frequently visited China in relation to his work.

The United States Geological Survey gives a China gold mine resource of 2,000 tonnes of gold - China says 14,000 tonnes of gold (what's 12,000 toones between friends - nearly $US 700 billion)? Might have slight economic significance.....

1625122452_rich_talk.jpg


https://geohug.rocks/

1625124467_rich.jpg
 
made in China = reverse engineered someone else's proprietary product

I've seen this first hand with USA proprierty triplex pumps that usually sell for USA $150 - 200K each!

Saw a great news story once where an Australian designed / built log split saw (cant remember correct name - sorry) got ripped off, the Chinese copied it to a T and even photocopied the owners manual and sent exact copies of the manual out with their knock off saws... this was used as evidence and was their undoing. The the Aussie business went through years of court cases before the International courts finally ruled in their favour, banning the China knock off company from trading for 10 years.

When I shop, if it says Made In China I walk out, period
 
Don't know about their mine reserves, but they sure went on a buying spree in 2019:

1625136190_china-gold-reserves.jpg


https://tradingeconomics.com/china/gold-reserves

If I was Richard Goldfarb (great name) I'd be more curious about the actual level of US physical reserves.

Seems no-one has been able to factually verify the existence of the alleged 8,100 tonnes of physical for a very long time:

(Warning: Long read)

According to the United States Treasury its 261 million ounces ( 8,100 tonnes) in official gold reserves are fully audited and accounted for. Because for many decades rumours are making rounds this gold has been covertly sold, in this essay well thoroughly scrutinise the audits indirectly evaluating the accuracy of the gold claims by the Treasury. What well encounter is a wide range of problems in the audit documentation obtained through Freedom of Information Act requests submitted at the US government. Among other problems, since inspections commenced at Fort Knox in 1974:

Most physically verified and sealed vault compartments have been re-opened, for which the auditor can provide no valid explanation.
Auditing personnel has proven to be utterly incompetent and did not follow the auditing policies and procedures.
Repeatedly metal has been excluded from verifications.
Many of the audit and assay documents have been destroyed.
The US government goes to great lengths in withholding information and spreading false information.
In conclusion, the audits have been executed with an inadequate degree of integrity.

https://www.bullionstar.com/blogs/k...audit and assay documents have been destroyed.

Been rumours around financial circles for ages about big, empty rooms in Fort Knox :)

I'm not sure that anybody tells the truth these days when it comes to economics and politics.
 
140 T is not much of a buying spree in a country that claims to produce more than 500 tonnes per year from its own mines. But I guess that is the point, isn't it....?

I don't know why everyone speculates about Fort Knox. "As of the last report on March 31, 2020, the vault at Fort Knox holds 147.37 million troy ounces of gold. That is roughly 4,583 metric tons of gold bars with a book value of around $6.2 billion and a current market value close to $236 billion".

$236 billion is small change in terms of national expenditure etc., they have been spending trillions. Only equal to a third of the apparent discrepancy in China's gold mine reserve figures. Hardly matters if it is there or not....barely worth a conspiracy. Australia produces hundreds of tonnes every year (and there is not much doubt about that), the USA produces similar annually, and that is also pretty reliable - annual world production is nearly that much, around 3,500 tonnes..

It is a good name for a gold prospector - it translates from German as "gold colour".

And yes, truth and politics...not words that fit well together.
 
China owns a lot more gold than its letting on and heres why

For those with short attention spans who dont want to read to the end of the article, Ill cut straight to the chase: China has much more gold than it says it does. In fact, China has more gold than the US. Its enormous gold hoards are all part of its grand global reserve currency status designs.

Right. Time to back up those assertions. Lets do an audit. Audits involve a lot of numbers and too many numbers can get a little overwhelming, so I will try to keep them to a mentally-digestible minimum. But let me start with perhaps the contextual figure and anchor that in your minds US gold holdings. Official records show the US owns some 8,133 tonnes, most of it in Fort Knox. It is the world's largest owner (or so you thought) and gold comprises 77% of its official foreign exchange reserves.

Chinas officially declared holdings of 1,948 tonnes make up just 3% of its $3.2trn in foreign exchange holdings, but the real number is much larger than that. China has been the worlds largest gold producer since 2007 this past decade it has produced about 15% of all the gold mined in the world; last year it produced 380 tonnes thats 20% more than the worlds second-largest producer, Australia.

Since 2000, China has mined roughly 6,500 tonnes. More than half of Chinese gold production is state-owned; the China National Gold Group Corporation alone accounts for 20%. Already that official 1,948 figure looks doubtful. Crucially, China keeps the gold it mines exporting of domestic mine production is not allowed.

With reserves in decline at home, Chinese mining companies have also been buying assets abroad, across Africa, South America and Asia. International production exceeded domestic production by about 15 tonnes last year. As well as being the worlds biggest producer, China is the worlds biggest importer. It is hard to get precise import figures, but we do know that, for example, via Hong Kong alone, over 6,000 tonnes has entered the country since 2000. Add that to cumulative gold production since 2000 and you get a figure of 13,200 tonnes.

Whether imported, mined or recycled, most of the gold that enters China goes through the Shanghai Gold Exchange (SGE), including the gold imported from Hong Kong. So SGE withdrawals for which we do have numbers can act as something of an approximation for demand. And it is possible to get numbers for SGE withdrawals: since 2008, roughly 20,000 tonnes have been withdrawn from the SGE.

https://moneyweek.com/investments/c...ow-much-gold-china-owns-yuan-reserve-currency

China opens its borders to billions of dollars of gold imports

China is world's biggest gold consumer
Demand collapsed during pandemic but now recovering
Central bank allows biggest imports since COVID - sources
About 150 tonnes to be shipped in April/May - sources

https://www.reuters.com/world/china...ions-dollars-gold-imports-sources-2021-04-16/

If, or more correctly, when, China launches its gold-backed digital yuan, it will matter greatly how much gold is in Fort Knox :)

The Reserve status of the USD will be very much at stake.
 
$5 bucks from K-mart . A bargain ! I have sun damage on my skin but no melanomas at the present time . Take care !
 
Mike678 said:
$5 bucks from K-mart . A bargain ! I have sun damage on my skin but no melanomas at the present time . Take care !
Don;t hink he was referring to YOUR hat Mike - but then perhaps he has a point.... :)
 

Latest posts

Top