Suspension upgrade for my ute??

[ProspectorPete]

Hi guys, I'm looking at getting an old 70's - 80's slide-on camper hopefully this year, something like the old Franklin's or Millard as the wife wants a caravan but I don't, a free standing slide-on is a good compromise so we still have the option of taking the boat when getting away for a weekend or holidays.

My '01 Landcruiser ute is pretty bouncy on the highway (front to rear bounce) and I'm pretty sure it's the original suspension so I'm thinking I'll probably need to look at upgrading the whole suspension at some stage but probably sooner before getting the slide-on.
Has anyone here had experience with the air bag suspension kits for the rear and would this be the way to go?
I'm happy to replace the whole suspension but hoping to get unbiased opinions on what may suit my needs best.
I always think the guy in the 4WD shop has an agenda to sell you a particular item and not necessarily what's best for your needs (it's just seems that way to me).
My driving of the ute is mainly weekends and holidays, most times empty but the rear is full of camping gear when getting away for weekends, on holidays like Bemm River recently it was chockers and with the boat on the back it had some sag, comfy ride though. 60% bitumen, 25% gravel tracks and 15% off road 4WD.
Adding the slide-on is probably going to add 600kgs dry?

Another project I have to do is replace the 1 1/2 passenger seat with a bucket seat for the wife, her feet don't touch the floor and she slides around so every time she hops in she puts 2 pillows on the floor and a pillow either side to stop sliding (she's not really that short) and I get sick of the front being full of crap (and pillows).
I went down to my local 4x4 shop and he quoted between $1800-$2K as they only use Recaro sports seats so that's not going to happen in my life time.
Has anyone here done a bucket seat conversion on these models and what seat did you use?
27 years ago I took the bench seat out of my HT Kingswood and just put 2 bucket seats in, drilling new holes through the floor and using any bolts I could find at the time and only had to re-tighten them every so often lol, luckily I never stacked it because I'd hate to think what would have happened on impact :8
Thankfully times have changed and I'd rather do it properly.

 

[k man]

I like old man emu myself.never had a problem.holden rodeo 2001. Stiffened her right up.I also run the same in my wife's Toyota Prado 120

 

[Andyndan]

Do the whole lot. Old man emu kit 2" lift and do the airbags. So when you have a heavy load on you can bring it to a good level ride hight . Iv had landcruiser utes from the age of 16. I'm now onto my 3rd one and I won't have anything else . You just can't kill them.
Cheers . Andy

 

[k man]

Good one Andyndan I forgot to mention my 2 inch lift, that's a must.and your right you can't kill em, mine have lasted 300k and still drive like new

 

[BJ Bates]

Hi ProspectorPete,

I had the same dilemma and no cash, so I contacted my local toyota dealer and asked could he help?? I was quoted like you many dollars for new ones to suit my year model etc,.... way out of my price range, but he said that he had brand spankin new ones on the shelf for a few dollars?? yep... I was sceptical and asked what was the catch? and he said that the Toyota utes which come from Jpan are stripped of their original suspensions and the springs are put on a rack for a rainy day or old pensioners like me who need them, these new rigs don't meet the mine standard and have to be upgraded.....simple... give me two rear leaf springs and two front coils and here's your $300... to say I was rapt is an understatement.. now I'm not sure if you want to go down this path but..... new springs and air bags must be a win win, don't you? reckon..cheers
ps they even had new bushes... bonus

BJ

 

[ProspectorPete]

It's certainly worth looking into BJ and makes a lot of sense why they have them on the shelf.
I'm happy to pay full price for a good suspension upgrade like the OME that have been recommended above and can see the value in doing so for my situation but it's the $2k for a bucket seat that I can't justify so I'll keep researching for a while before deciding which way to go.
I should let mrs PP drive as she's happy doing so for the comfortable seat, I can kick back and enjoy an early beverage or two but I'm not a good passenger and prefer to be driving on our trips out.

 

[Tathradj]

As for the bucket seats, borrow a passenger one out of a 4Runner and have a look at it against yours.
Toyota's are fairly "Plug and Play" and There is a good chance it will just bolt in or bolt to your Landcruiser brackets without having to drill holes.
I do not know the laws in Victoria but here in NSW, You cannot just build a set of seat brackets and bolt them in.
They must fit the original seat bolt positions and if they don't, you have to have them checked by an engineer.
You can pick up a good set of seats for a couple of hundred.

 

[boobook]

There is no doubt the standard leaf spring suspension on the older cab/chassis is pretty P/weak.
I installed genuine Polyair inflatable bellows on the rear and modified a pair of Monro air shocks for the front.
(heavy bullbar/winch setup)
We are pretty much fully loaded all the time, never have a problem with the ride or levelling.
The polyair bags will each support 1000kg.@100psi. I run them at ~40psi.
Front shocks the same, ~40psi.
Mike

 

[Guest]

Iv got the poly air bags in the back of our grand vitara' 15 PSI is enough to level the car with a additional fridge,esky and camper trailer hitched and still be a smooth ride.

The poly bags do fail but also work well' it's a small cost to have a back up spare in the toolbox.

 

[BJ Bates]

Hi Prospectorpete,

The seat issue is a bit of a funny one ie: I was trying to score some brownie points with the missus and a mate wanted to swap seats with me as he had a partner with a 10yr old rugrat so we swapped 1 brand new Stratos top of the range passenger bucket seat for the 3/4 bench seat in my ute which is a 2001 78 series and his seat was from a 2001 series turbo model though and when I got it into position in my ute there was one bolt hole that wouldn't align exactly as the original 3/4 bench seat in my ute, so be aware that all is not what it seems with seat bolt holes....and yes I've still got the old seat in my ute and returned the Stratos.....Bugger.
I not sure whether this is a design of the floor plan of both model utes or what but no matter how much jiggling, cursing and frustrating in and outs with the seat we just couldn't make it work.

BJ

 

[colby]

Hi Prospectorpete
I built a slide on myself (this forum under campers,4wd and vans, under "slide on")and as it was made from steel(I cant weld ali) it came out at 750kg wet weight. I too have a land cruiser(96) and when the slide on was finished the ute had a pronounced sag in the rear end and was all over the road.I researched and ask the experts and decided to install airbags. I installed "Thor" bellow airbags at home purch. off the 'net for $450 . They will handle 120psi although I only need to run them at 40psi to raise the back end by 40mm. By doing this it transferred some of the weight(I presume)forward by making the rear slightly higher than the front and stopped 85% of the body roll.They are made of very tough vulcanised rubber and come to suit many makes and models.
One draw back with installing heavy duty springs especially on the older utes is that the suspension becomes very stiff and unyielding when the ute is empty, hence giving a rough ride, and also this could set up chassis cracks because something has to give as the stresses are transfered to another part of the vehicle.
If you suspect that the suspension is original I would be checking your shockies first because if the ute bounces like you said that is a classic sympton. Simply remove them off the ute, pull them to extend them to max and if there is reasonable resistance and they return slowly by themselves or you have to push them closed with a certain amount of force then they are in good nick. Hope this helps
Colby

 

[Tathradj]

If some thing does not line up, Have a look underneath. There may be a captive bolt sitting underneath with the floor skin covering it.

Hi Prospectorpete,

The seat issue is a bit of a funny one ie: I was trying to score some brownie points with the missus and a mate wanted to swap seats with me as he had a partner with a 10yr old rugrat so we swapped 1 brand new Stratos top of the range passenger bucket seat for the 3/4 bench seat in my ute which is a 2001 78 series and his seat was from a 2001 series turbo model though and when I got it into position in my ute there was one bolt hole that wouldn't align exactly as the original 3/4 bench seat in my ute, so be aware that all is not what it seems with seat bolt holes....and yes I've still got the old seat in my ute and returned the Stratos.....Bugger.
I not sure whether this is a design of the floor plan of both model utes or what but no matter how much jiggling, cursing and frustrating in and outs with the seat we just couldn't make it work.

BJ

 

[ProspectorPete]

Thanks Colby, that makes a lot of sense mate.
I've suspected the front shocks are shot for a while so will take one out and test when I get the chance.
My concern with getting the full suspension upgrade was that I'd have a rougher ride empty which would be most times, the camper would only get used a handful of times each year so maybe upgrading the 4 shocks plus bags under the rear is the best compromise for comfort and practicality. I need to do more research on it.

As far as the seat goes I called into a local 4x4 wreckers yesterday and asked about a passenger seat, his advise was there is no seat that will bolt straight in, whatever seat I use there needs to be a modification made to fit it properly.
I have one more person that was recommended to ask about the seat and suspension so will chase that up next week and see what his thoughts are and what can be done.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Pete, I used Holden Camera Bucket Seats in an Old Landrover, But I think they had Height Adjusters on them, My ex was a bit on the short side, She had Turn ups on her Draws So they worked out real good, Aye

 

[bushpig]

Has anyone used iron man? I noticed a bin of brand new iron man shokies at a local 4x4 store for 20 bucks each I guess thats enough info if they are almost giving them away.

 

[kawman]

The slide on campers take the mickey out of standard suspension with their tall heavy loads on soft/hard suspension on utes for sure... do not place anything with weight that adds up in the top/high storage areas of the campers.. keep the center of weight as low as you can and the roll over will be greatly reduced... better/stiffer sway bars can be a blessing to help with the extra body roll but are far too hard with the camper body removed for normal use as a ute....

 

[ProspectorPete]

Pete, I used Holden Camera Bucket Seats in an Old Landrover, But I think they had Height Adjusters on them, My ex was a bit on the short side, She had Turn ups on her Draws So they worked out real good, Aye

Seems there's no seat that will just bolt straight in so until I find another option that won't cost the earth I've suggested to the wife that we can stick Velcro on the seat and stitch some on the arse of her jeans.

Well ......... the look I got was priceless :lol:

 

[Ridge Runner]

Pete, I used Holden Camera Bucket Seats in an Old Landrover, But I think they had Height Adjusters on them, My ex was a bit on the short side, She had Turn ups on her Draws So they worked out real good, Aye

Seems there's no seat that will just bolt straight in so until I find another option that won't cost the earth I've suggested to the wife that we can stick Velcro on the seat and stitch some on the arse of her jeans.

Well ......... the look I got was priceless :lol:

If you was A Gentleman You Would Offer to Hold Her Arse A Not Let A Lady Suffer In Silence,

Pete?? Pete?? Pete The Way Men Are Viewed Form this Moment On Is In Your hands, So ask your self which would rather have your hands full Of??

Pete seriously, Making a frame is easy and you use the original Holden Sliders and bolt them to the frame or just use as many of the bolt holes on the runners that fit and make small brackets to adapt the Holden Runners to the Toyota Bolt holes, Ok.

John

 

[ProspectorPete]

I'll look into it John but I don't want to compromise safety in any way, been told you need an engineers cert. if you modify for insurance purposes.
When I was 18yo I didn't think too much about it but now it's a different story.
Still going to look into getting the 3/4 bench reupholstered with built in body huggers when I can find a good upholsterer to speak with so there's still a couple of options open.

 

[Ridge Runner]

I'll look into it John but I don't want to compromise safety in any way, been told you need an engineers cert. if you modify for insurance purposes.
When I was 18yo I didn't think too much about it but now it's a different story.
Still going to look into getting the 3/4 bench reupholstered with built in body huggers when I can find a good upholsterer to speak with so there's still a couple of options open.

Yeah I understand Mate, better be safe than sorry,